Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha256; boundary="B_3745569970_1987441620" --B_3745569970_1987441620 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3745569970_220144052" --B_3745569970_220144052 Content-type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Does it mean that NIST is not interested in lattice-based schemes?=20 =20 I have in mind specifically https://eprint.iacr.org/2022/1155.pdf , which I= MHO would be nice to see considered for Round 4. =20 Thanks! -- V/R, Uri =20 There are two ways to design a system. One is to make it so simple there ar= e obviously no deficiencies. The other is to make it so complex there are no obvious deficiencies. = - C. A. R. Hoare =20 =20 From: "'Moody, Dustin (Fed)' via pqc-forum" Reply-To: Dustin Moody Date: Friday, September 9, 2022 at 12:02 To: Paul Hoffman , pqc-forum Subject: Re: [Ext] [pqc-forum] Call for Additional Signatures is released =20 Paul, =20 As noted in my previous email, "NIST is primarily interested in additional = general-purpose signature schemes that are not based on structured lattices= ." For applications such as DNSSEC, where both public key and signature siz= e are a concern, these schemes would likely be the ones of most interest (i= n addition to those already selected). =20 Separately from the interest in general-purpose signature schemes, NIST und= erstands that some applications would benefit from signature sizes that are= substantially smaller than those of Dilithium or Falcon even if the scheme= s had relatively large public key sizes. Certificate transparency happens t= o be one example that is well known and that is part of a widely-used proto= col (HTTP over TLS). As Bas noted, CT involves a small number of public key= s that are distributed out-of-band and a large number of signatures (2 or m= ore per initial TLS handshake) that are distributed in-band. There are othe= r applications where accepting (potentially) much larger public keys in exc= hange for much smaller signatures would be a good tradeoff, but CT is likel= y the most well known and most widely used one. =20 We would expect some submissions to target the non-lattice-based general-pu= rpose use case and some to target the small-signature use case. We were not= necessarily expecting to receive any submissions that would be good genera= l-purpose signature schemes that also had small signatures and fast verific= ation. =20 Dustin =20 =20 From: pqc-forum@list.nist.gov on behalf of Paul Hoffman Sent: Tuesday, September 6, 2022 5:42 PM To: pqc-forum Subject: Re: [Ext] [pqc-forum] Call for Additional Signatures is released= =20 =20 On Sep 6, 2022, at 1:15 PM, 'Moody, Dustin (Fed)' via pqc-forum wrote: > For certain applications, such as certificate transparency, NIST may also= be interested in signature schemes that have short signatures and fast ver= ification. Can you say more about the motivation here? Are you forcusing on schemes th= at have possibly-giant keys but short signatures, or are you still hoping f= or schemes that have a variety of different key/signature size balances? I = ask as someone who supports a protocol (DNSSEC) that is concerned with deli= vering both keys and signatures, so size of each will matter to us. --Paul Hoffman --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= pqc-forum" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to pqc-forum+unsubscribe@list.nist.gov. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/a/list.n= ist.gov/d/msgid/pqc-forum/13C6E198-B827-434C-9EF8-1AA8609A8DDD%40icann.org. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= pqc-forum" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to pqc-forum+unsubscribe@list.nist.gov. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/a/list.n= ist.gov/d/msgid/pqc-forum/SA1PR09MB86699EFD77C84C6C5902613EE5439%40SA1PR09M= B8669.namprd09.prod.outlook.com. --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= pqc-forum" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to pqc-forum+unsubscribe@list.nist.gov. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/a/list.n= ist.gov/d/msgid/pqc-forum/9B454A1B-4533-49A9-A0F9-74CF81F6BEF6%40ll.mit.edu= . --B_3745569970_220144052 Content-type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Does it mean that NIST is <= u>not interested in lattice-based schemes?

 

I have in mind speci= fically https://eprint.ia= cr.org/2022/1155.pdf , which IMHO would be nice to see considered for R= ound 4.

 

Thanks!

= --

V/R,

Uri

 

There are two ways to design a system. One is = to make it so simple there are obviously no deficiencies.

The other is to make it so complex the= re are no obvious deficiencies.

          &nbs= p;              = ;            &n= bsp;            = ;            &n= bsp;            = ;            &n= bsp;            = ;            &n= bsp;            = ;        -  C. A. R. Hoare

<= /div>

 = ;

 

From: "'Moody, Dustin (Fed)' via p= qc-forum" <pqc-forum@list.nist.gov>
Reply-To: Dustin M= oody <dustin.moody@nist.gov>
Date: Friday, September 9, 202= 2 at 12:02
To: Paul Hoffman <paul.hoffman@icann.org>, pqc-f= orum <pqc-forum@list.nist.gov>
Subject: Re: [Ext] [pqc-foru= m] Call for Additional Signatures is released

 

Paul,

 

As noted in my previous = email, "NIST is primarily interested in additional general-purpose sig= nature schemes that are not based on structured lattices." For applica= tions such as DNSSEC, where both public key and signature size are a concer= n, these schemes would likely be the ones of most interest (in addition to = those already selected).

 

Separately from the interest in general-purpose signatu= re schemes, NIST understands that some applications would benefit from sign= ature sizes that are substantially smaller than those of Dilithium or Falco= n even if the schemes had relatively large public key sizes. Certificate tr= ansparency happens to be one example that is well known and that is part of= a widely-used protocol (HTTP over TLS). As Bas noted, CT involves a small = number of public keys that are distributed out-of-band and a large number o= f signatures (2 or more per initial TLS handshake) that are distributed in-= band. There are other applications where accepting (potentially) much large= r public keys in exchange for much smaller signatures would be a good trade= off, but CT is likely the most well known and most widely used one.<= span style=3D'color:#201F1E'>

 =

We would exp= ect some submissions to target the non-lattice-based general-purpose use ca= se and some to target the small-signature use case. We were not necessarily= expecting to receive any submissions that would be good general-purpose si= gnature schemes that also had small signatures and fast verification.

 

Dustin

 

 =

From:= pqc-forum@list.nist.gov on be= half of Paul Hoffman
Sent: Tuesday, September 6, 2022 5:42 PM
= To: pqc-forum
Subject: Re: [Ext] [pqc-forum] Call for Addi= tional Signatures is released

=  

On Sep 6, 2022, at 1:15 PM, 'Moody, Dustin (Fed)' vi= a pqc-forum <pqc-forum@list.nist.gov> wrote:
> For certain appl= ications, such as certificate transparency, NIST may also be interested in = signature schemes that have short signatures and fast verification.

= Can you say more about the motivation here? Are you forcusing on schemes th= at have possibly-giant keys but short signatures, or are you still hoping f= or schemes that have a variety of different key/signature size balances? I = ask as someone who supports a protocol (DNSSEC) that is concerned with deli= vering both keys and signatures, so size of each will matter to us.

= --Paul Hoffman

--
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You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;pqc-forum" group.
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